Melirei
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It's unreduced.
Quick question - Quick answer
- Thread starter NYT Raven
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what does this mean? ir ead on wiki that launchers have diminishing damage or something? i dont understand
Melirei
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Launchers (like Guilty Light) have a piercing attack that hits up to 4 targets, but additional targets does not receive the full damage. The damage is roughly like 100%-50%-50%-25% (I don't know the actual numbers).
S-Rank Launcher is an exception, all targets receive the full damage.
Rufus Tsynorca
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Thanks Melirei, that's good to know.
I might bring mine along with me then; could serve as a poor-mans Snow Queen for now. lol
@gizonde - To follow up on what Melirei said, the first target takes full damage, and each subsequent target takes 50% .
So, 500 damage, 250, 125, 62. The S-Rank would do 500 damage to all 4 enemies. It's why I personally love S-Rank Launcher with Zerk. It's absolutely wonderful on a RAmar. ^_^
I might bring mine along with me then; could serve as a poor-mans Snow Queen for now. lol
@gizonde - To follow up on what Melirei said, the first target takes full damage, and each subsequent target takes 50% .
So, 500 damage, 250, 125, 62. The S-Rank would do 500 damage to all 4 enemies. It's why I personally love S-Rank Launcher with Zerk. It's absolutely wonderful on a RAmar. ^_^
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Jbangalanga
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I am not all that familiar with S-Ranks. But can someone explain to be why zalure gun is a popular choice?
Is the zalure AoE, or just single target? If it is single target, which mobs do you use it on?
As a HUcast soloing.. are you supposed to zalure a target and switch to a different weapon to kill it, or can you just use a couple of power attacks from the gun to kill most things?
I guess I am trying to decide between zalure/gun, zalure/j-cutter, arrest/j-cutter for HUcast solo play.
Is the zalure AoE, or just single target? If it is single target, which mobs do you use it on?
As a HUcast soloing.. are you supposed to zalure a target and switch to a different weapon to kill it, or can you just use a couple of power attacks from the gun to kill most things?
I guess I am trying to decide between zalure/gun, zalure/j-cutter, arrest/j-cutter for HUcast solo play.
Rufus Tsynorca
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It was MA:Spaceship that made me think about this. There's one spawn early on with a Baranz and 3 Gilchichs; one on each side and one in front. The FS wouldn't work on it, since even if I stepped to the side to snipe the Baranz, I'd target the Gilchich infront or beside instead.
In this situation the goal is only to stop the Baranz attacking, so I'm only needing Guilty Light to freeze a single enemy with reasonable consistency. So the question really is, how well does unreduced Blizzard do at freezing a single enemy?
The Zalure gun is generally used for Bosses or big enemies like Del Lily or Girtablublu. Since it's fast and long ranged, you can quickly switch to it, Special attack, and the boss has LV21 Zalure on it. The Zalure is powerful enough to make a pretty good difference. Then you can carry on and kill it with whatever you like.
That said, S-Rank Zalure does not have AoE, and is only useful on the RAmar and Casts.
HUcast shouldn't really need a Zalure S-Rank due to his ridiculous ATP anyway. I'd argue you'd get much better use out of an Arrest Cutter. I would also add that S-Rank Slicer is only 30 ATP weaker than Cutter. The Slicer in practicality is every bit as good as the Cutter, so just use whichever is easier for you to get.
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Spuz
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HUcast is so OP that even in solo mode he doesn't need Zalure for most things. The Zalure gun is single target but can easily target that single enemy. Situation in which HUcast could use is all of the bosses, and larger enemies like gibbles (usually only 1 of 2 of these larger enemies about, unless you play some crazy quest in multi which would have a FO/other usually)
The only places I really use Zalure jcutter on is De Rol Lee as example.
Also I would prioritise srank Arrest cutter since control is more important. While you already have FTs, the jcutter saves on them, and not all enemies can be frozen. Plus it's pretty damn good with SNS. Then there is the while Arrest +Freeze stacking.
I guess, like..it wasn't that reliable Imo so I didn't keep it or didn't use (might have somewhere). But like I said I didn't test alot (that I remember). So it's defo worth testing out in more situations than 5 mins of CCA.
Jbangalanga
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Thanks that is kind of what I was thinking; but you always see these things around which made me wonder how important they were.
Melirei
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I haven't tried that hard, but I think this might work: after sidestepping, you could try to snap target the FS special to hit the Baranz. Essentially it allows you to not automatically target the Gilchichs, but whether the shot could pass between the Gilchichs correctly, I don't know.
If this doesn't work, it may be better to just go behind the gilchichs before they spawn if you don't have an SQ.
Since Blizzard is currently capped at 0.4 (0.6 after V50x), even with perfect accuracy and low ESP on the enemy, the chance to freeze per shot is at most 60%.
Rufus Tsynorca
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Thanks for the video. Although I've never heard of a name being put to this effect, it's a technique that I'm personally aware of and have used now and then. However, the manual accuracy that I'd need in this case is more hassle than I can be bothered with. Particularly given my bad keyboard and how terribly it ghosts.
The thing with Blizzard being capped is a pain in the ass, but even with the cap of 60% (and 100% accuracy), the odds of any one hit in a combo freezing would be 93.6% (84% if discounting the first attack). It's not ideal, but certainly not bad; particularly when you've got a slow enemy. Even comparing it to the likes of an Arrest weapon... Arrest will be better up to 40 ESP due to the cap on Blizzard, but after 40 ESP Blizzard becomes equally as effective as Arrest. Outside of grunts, most enemies do dance around that 40 mark; typically 35 to 50. What it means is that on paper, Blizzard is equally as effective as Arrest in disabling most of the non-grunt enemies. So I guess this does kinda answer my question; it's not ideal but is viable.
Of course, if anybody actually has a Blizzard weapon that they use, I'd be curious to know how they feel it works ingame. Numbers are one thing, but how it functions in practice is quite another.
Edit: You know... I had a little think about what Spuz said with his testing of Guilty Light. Even with 80% Hit, I'll discount the first hit. Grunts have less than 40 ESP, so working on the cap of 60%, the odds of the 2nd or 3rd hit freezing would be 84%. In a mob of 4 enemies, the odds of all of them being frozen in one combo would be 49.7%. If he's talking of only getting 2 or 3 enemies, and even then inconsistently, I'm thinking that Guilty Light might actually be reduced.
The thing with Blizzard being capped is a pain in the ass, but even with the cap of 60% (and 100% accuracy), the odds of any one hit in a combo freezing would be 93.6% (84% if discounting the first attack). It's not ideal, but certainly not bad; particularly when you've got a slow enemy. Even comparing it to the likes of an Arrest weapon... Arrest will be better up to 40 ESP due to the cap on Blizzard, but after 40 ESP Blizzard becomes equally as effective as Arrest. Outside of grunts, most enemies do dance around that 40 mark; typically 35 to 50. What it means is that on paper, Blizzard is equally as effective as Arrest in disabling most of the non-grunt enemies. So I guess this does kinda answer my question; it's not ideal but is viable.
Of course, if anybody actually has a Blizzard weapon that they use, I'd be curious to know how they feel it works ingame. Numbers are one thing, but how it functions in practice is quite another.
Edit: You know... I had a little think about what Spuz said with his testing of Guilty Light. Even with 80% Hit, I'll discount the first hit. Grunts have less than 40 ESP, so working on the cap of 60%, the odds of the 2nd or 3rd hit freezing would be 84%. In a mob of 4 enemies, the odds of all of them being frozen in one combo would be 49.7%. If he's talking of only getting 2 or 3 enemies, and even then inconsistently, I'm thinking that Guilty Light might actually be reduced.
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Spuz
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I use Blizzard quite a bit actually. Not as often as other specials since FS/SQ/FT are things and I rarely solo. I've got Blizzard Raygun on all my non-ras. I also have srank j-cutter and needle.
- Raygun works on goran detonators, mericarols, and such pretty decently on both HUcaseal/Humar (more so on cast because of boosts, it is noticeable). I use it frequently actually.
- The needle I sometimes use in Ep4 because gorans being stuck midwarp paralysed is so aids but mostly I don't use it much. Sometimes I take it to mines, but it's not really consistent enough for sinows/Baranz. It's decent enough for gilchichs which are, well already slow and easy to handle but it can be pretty fun. (thinking of making a shot too sometime).
- J-cutter can be pretty effective also, SNS is OP, and makes Humar/FOmarl have some fun.
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Rufus Tsynorca
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Ah, I edited my post as you were typing that.
It's sounding like Guilty Light is actually reduced. Blizzard is looking pretty decent from what you're saying Spuz, and potentially an S-Rank Blizzard Launcher would work. Even then though, it's not really any sort of replacement for FS or SQ. Due to SQ, it'd be better to hit an area through a Needle or Shot rather than piercing anyway.
It's sounding like Guilty Light is actually reduced. Blizzard is looking pretty decent from what you're saying Spuz, and potentially an S-Rank Blizzard Launcher would work. Even then though, it's not really any sort of replacement for FS or SQ. Due to SQ, it'd be better to hit an area through a Needle or Shot rather than piercing anyway.
Melirei
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I did some tests and my conclusion is still that it's unreduced, unless there are some really subtle difference between it and the S-Rank.
As for what happened in Spuz' tests, note that CCA creatures have 910~1000 EVP, and not even 80h Guilty Light can hit it reliably with special attacks. From what I noticed in the tests, making the Launcher shots pass through the enemies you want is also rather difficult -- the shots seems to bounce off often, or something.
Rufus Tsynorca
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I must've skimmed it then, I missed the fact he was doing it in CCA. I was basing my thoughts on him going up against Barbles, Vulmers and such
That changes things... with an SSS combo putting 367 ATA against 1,000 EVP:
1) 0% (-16.5%)
2) 38%
3) 100%
The grunts here will cause Blizzard to hit its cap of 60%
This means that the odds of freezing would be :
1) 0%
2) 22.8%
3) 60%
This means that in a single combo, there is 69.12% for a successful activation on a single enemy, and 22.82% of freezing 4 enemies. With those odds, you're talking an average of 5 combos to freeze an entire group of 4 enemies. Even then, there's enemies with around 1,000 EVP and higher ESP, so the chances would be lower still. Interestingly enough though, a 50 hit Snow Queen would have 51% chance of hitting a 1,000 EVP enemy. However, the odds of hitting 4 enemies with one shot is 6.76%; but Rifles are reasonably quick, so you could fire a couple of shots in the time one Guilty Light combo takes.
Okay, you've convinced me that Guilty Light is unreduced.
As for the bouncing shots of the Launcher... it's one of the few times where your character height actually matters. If you're too tall, then firing at a close enemy will cause you to fire down in to the hitbox, leading to the launcher bullet dissipating in the ground. As for the SNS; it's not really doable. The Launcher doesn't have quite enough range for how slow the weapon is. Phonon Maser could maybe manage due to the slow bullets, but the special there is Havoc rather than Chaos, so not as useful.
Lileya
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Hmm... I wonder who that friend is. :blobthinking:
VENOM
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it can be laborious unless you have a fo that can equip it to unseal it with. People normally charge 5pd for the unseal which isn't a bad rate.
People use the quest Beyond the Horizons or Max Attack S (ep4) to unseal.
Keinai
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So if I use my FOmar and go into lets say MAE forest with others, do I need to get the kill or as long as I tag it?