Proposed New Drop Charts

After reading all the posts in this topic and the original topic I think 1 idea would be beneficial to share.
Ubers don't make an ID.
They're just hope in a bottle while the rest of your drops make up 99% of your experience with the game. Those of who have hunted just about anything over 1/10k can probably go on for days expressing that to you if given the chance.
 
Even 1/2500 can be hope in a bottle for this game. Stupid blue limiter not wanting to drop for me.
 
Reading one of Girth's reply, I think adding some usable 10 stars/midgame weapons, e.g. Demo Comet, Girasole(?), to the Ep2 chart is a good idea, as Ep2's native 10 stars table seems to be pretty poor, e.g. Ancient Saber, Victor Axe, ... Although speaking of it, almost all of the usable midgame weapons seems to be located in Ep1.

Although if the objective for dropchart change was just to switch out the filler drops, then there might not be spots for them.
 
I'm personally unsure as to what to do with buffing anything right now, as the majority of drops are basically all used. I'm not trying to make Episode 2 the episode that drops everything, so stuff like Red weapons and Spread Needle can stay in Episode 1.

If anything, the best thing to do would be to take one more thing outside of Episode 4 to place into Spaceship, because Episode 4 is still far better than anything else right now.
 
I think you got cold feet and lost confidence in what you were doing cause of shitty suggestions from people who have far less time than you and certain select few people building the rates. Nothing on these new rates is even remotely broken for 10000 people, let alone 100-150. SS needs help still. Every area in the game should have at least one ID that says "dayum cant wait to get to X to hunt for Y" that isnt just some Uber that 1% of players will see anyways. Do it for the average. Not retards you know don't know shit or the 15 people on the server who probably should've stopped playing years ago including myself.
 
Nope.

Honestly if we were to do what you proposed, I'd have to nerf Episode 4 even more and also change up Episode 1, which is not what people voted on.

Furthermore I disagree that "there's only 100-150 players" means rates should be easier. You're playing PSO, you know what you're getting into. You don't expect other games to become easier just because there's less people playing.

Also no "cold feet" happened. Everything is being discussed, we're not just doing things because people say so.
 
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Anyway:

- Heaven Striker Coat has been removed from Ultimate and will be put into Very Hard, replacing the Yunchang drops.
- Lavis Cannon on Episode 2 Hildetorr has been changed to Syncesta as an alternative hunt, regarding what GHOSTS said.
- Added V101 to Viridia Zu since right now it's basically a worse Skyly.
 
"- Added V101 to Viridia Zu since right now it's basically a worse Skyly."

I LoL'ed

I'm very excited to play some more Ep. 2 in the future. It just has a more epic feel to it, imo.
 
I'm going to leave a final thought on the rates of ubers here as I'm simply done discussing it, and I'm posting it here for the chance for people to publicly reply to get thoughts on it. I'm going to be pretty direct here so hold onto your butts for DISSENTING OPINIONS. I know the chart isn't finalized yet but I want to get this out there.

The thing I fought for most in the chart changes, is the global fixing of ubers. As someone who has for the lack of a better term NOLIFE'D this game somewhere around 12-13 years online, I can safely say that the ridiculous and completely UNREASONABLE drop rates for things like the Sinow Zele pwand and HP, the yellowboze assassin HP, and the Del lily pwand are not fair drops. Now I know the counter to this is that they're not designed to be and that is completely fair. However, I feel that if these drops are not within reason we're wasting a slot as they simple DO NOT DROP over 1/100k, and the only time we see these drop is when broken quests like Xrd force enemies out the wazoo, or with modified RDR+DAR at event times like Xmas. The enemies they drop from are not common, (for some players) are hard to get to and defeat, and to have a drop (some that in my long stay with PSO I've never seen drop in 13 years, which is ludicrous considering my play time) that is simply unseen or unheard of compared to its better drops is simply a waste of time and potential item slot.

The suggested 1/50k rates were fine, break nothing, and UNLIKE SOME SUGGESTED would not have ubers falling out of peoples butts. The rates I fought to have, were for them to have a chance to happen, not to make them main focus hunts that wasn't my intent. 1/50k is still a miracle drop, it is that 1/lol chance, but unlike the other hard hunts it is a drop like this CAN HAPPEN. These also at the same time do not devalue, replace, replicate, or even slightly degrade the other drops like delbiter blueful pwand, or Torr HP as they're simply better like has been suggested.

The rates as they were changed simply allow for the potential for these items to appear, albeit a very very very low chance at 1/50k or so. I will admit due to del lily being very abundant that should be about 1/70k that's digressing a bit.

my tl;dr is Attacking the changed rates, and wanting a 1/never (I have to stress that word) rate is basically invalidating an item even being on its chart placement at all. I can tell you from playing this for years, and as someone who struggled with a 1/12k rate for 8+years alone that wanting a 1/300k rate because of fear of devaluing a item that hardly drops even with its better rates is simply irrational and has no basis. Yes I'm being butthurt, I'll go ice it now.
 
Nobody is suggesting there will be ubers dropping everywhere. The problem is though, many 1/50,000 (or whatever rates) are alongside common hunts that people would play often (examples: Redria Ruins Sorc, Whitill Del Lily, Pinkal Zele, Redria Zele, Redria Girtablulu), causing far more accidental uber drops than actual hunted uber drops, meaning the ubers would no longer be trophy items that you'd have to hunt for.

They're already niche, and taking away the fact that you pretty much must hunt for them right now would make them worth much less in the majority of peoples' eyes. This is why the event ubers have ended completely, as we realised that was entirely a mistake.

And if 1/50,000 supposedly never drops, why is this such a big deal?

If you really want an uber, go hunt it on an ID that drops it regularly, and the other IDs have actual miracle drops which will almost never happen accidently, which would not be the case if the drop rates were around 1/50,000 as time goes on.

For many people on PSO, these "impossible hunts" are what drives them to keep playing. They want to earn that trophy item for themselves, no matter how long it takes, and the fact that many accidental ones may start dropping as people hunt other items is only going to kill those sorts of drives.

You're playing PSO. It's literally a game about hunting the impossible. If you don't like it, this isn't the game for you.
 
How very authoritarian of you Matt... "dont like it then leave". :\ You're banking on this assumption once again that these drops will simply come out of nowhere just because they become attainable at all. Yknow as well as I do that the fixed proposed rates do nothing to make them more common, if that was the case we'd see a deluge more bluefull torr HP's at their better rates. I know that's a bit of a strawman but reverting the rates to trash accomplishes keeping those drops useless, I don't see a point in making what is already a 1/lol drop completely useless. Yes they're still miracle drops but at least they'd be attainable. To simply brush it off and say "Go hunt it somewhere else!" is a complete farce that does nothing to fix them, because having some monolithic unattainable drop isn't a a grind, or even a hunt it's going to be completely ignored. People were already going to hunt the better drop, having a potential uber cross hunt that still is very unlikely is my point. Especially when these enemies are NOT common.
 
Let's give an example.

There are 3 "easy" Psycho Wand drops. They are:

Purplenum Mil Lily, Oran Gibbles and Bluefull Delbiter.

Currently, if hunting for either of these, there are no other worthwhile items to get around them. Someone going into Caves with a Purplenum is specifically hunting for Psycho Wand (or just playing Caves because it's fun). If you're hunting Delbiters with Bluefull, you're not going to get anything alongside it while hunting.

Now, let's say we put Psycho Wand at 1/50,000 on Whitill Del Lily.

Chances are, Whitill will be a pretty popular ID for hunting since the Ill Gill rate is one of the better ones for V502 (with Greenill Mericarol probably being the best). This means it will get run far more than the specific uber IDs, because V502 is a realistic drop worth a decent amount that you can hope to see in a relatively short amount of time. However, because of the volume of people running Whitill Tower to get V502, there will end up being far more Psycho Wands dropped as a consequence of people hunting V502 in Tower rather than people hunting for Psycho Wand specifically.

It might be unlikely, but at the end of the day the weapon will end up being more common through circumstance and not people hunting it.

This is what we're avoiding, and the new proposed rates will definitely make them more common.

So after thinking about it, I'm going to have to agree with Skylar and Melirei on this one. It's definitely not a "kneejerk reaction", which is actually what you are doing.
 
Matt said:
If you're hunting Delbiters with Bluefull, you're not going to get anything alongside it while hunting.
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Zanba?

I must say, for this once I will agree with Collette. It would be cool to have such an uber drop while hunting something else... It would eventually drop a bit more yes.... but 50k is still incredible low and perhaps once in a 3-4 month drop if ppl start spamming for v502...maybe even less. It needs 40 v502 drops before a über might drop ratio wise. I find it reasonable...but I won't be mad if it won't happen.
 
Colette said:
Yknow as well as I do that the fixed proposed rates do nothing to make them more common
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i know that's not what you mean but uh... a 1/50k drop is six times more common than a 1/300k drop lol

Colette said:
we'd see a deluge more bluefull torr HP's at their better rates
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not really. most people would rather do hp on purp or skyly nowadays and save forest spamming for fs because that's a gun that actually drops. the rare monster 1/204s are just there so you get a better chance of the item in exchange for having to suffer through another horrible chance. they even out to like 1/80~100k or some shit otherwise
 
As a whole, from what the charts are looking like at the time of this post-- EP2 is definetly looking miles better than before and EP4 after being adjusted to bring EP2 looks good. I support these changes except one thing I have to object on:

NOTHING should have a drop rate grater than 1/100K, or simply put, a six digit ratio. It's beyond reasonable for anything to be that rare. Yes, I read the arguments on both sides, to which there are merits both ways-- however, it should be reasonable enough to bring those drops that are in excess of 1/100K+ down to the 50-80K region.

I'd like to use the Viridia and Bluefull Delbiter Psychowand example:

Viridia's drop rate is 1/131072 whereas Bluefull is at 1/12603-- more than 10 times more likely to drop. Both of these IDs get PGF. As for the other drops in Seabed, both IDs are fairly comparable to each other in terms of overall quality, but I would personally go with Bluefull as being a little better. Based on the counterarguments I saw about bringing down the rates on ubers on certain IDs would purportedly result in more of that uber dropping enough to deflate the value of it on the economy and bring ire to players who specifically hunt that uber on another ID.

At least in the example I provided above, that argument seems to be unwarranted. My proposal for the above example is to at least give the Viridia Psychowand an adjustment to at least 1/28K. Frankly, I believe the 1/28K rate should be the absolute lowest drop rate across the board, but I know that's a can of worms and a stance that needs heavier scrutiny before even being considered.
 
Colette said:
I can tell you from playing this for years, and as someone who struggled with a 1/12k rate for 8+years alone that wanting a 1/300k rate because of fear of devaluing a item that hardly drops even with its better rates is simply irrational and has no basis. Yes I'm being butthurt, I'll go ice it now
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It's not irrational with no basis. I was willing to pay around ~350 PDs for a Psycho Wand. And then due to plat badge and Fiasco mil lily spam, a bunch dropped and 2-3 of them were sold within a span of like 1 month, and all of a sudden they were now worth 200 PDs (or less).

If Psycho Wand started dropping as a secondary item while people were hunting other high value items, this WOULD happen all over again. I might hunt one to sell it to a player from an actual Psycho Wand ID, and then 2 other people might get lucky and find one as a result of a side hunt around the same time, and now the uber I hunted for (with the intention of selling it) is worth 150+ PDs less than it was before cuz a couple people got lucky while hunting v502.

Besides this, there would actually be no point in hunting it, because if I wanted one it would be easier to just spend 150-200 PDs on it once its value deflates.

Colette said:
Yknow as well as I do that the fixed proposed rates do nothing to make them more common, if that was the case we'd see a deluge more bluefull torr HP's at their better rates.
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No one hunts this on that ID from that enemy.

Ceri0n said:
I must say, for this once I will agree with Collette. It would be cool to have such an uber drop while hunting something else... It would eventually drop a bit more yes.... but 50k is still incredible low and perhaps once in a 3-4 month drop if ppl start spamming for v502...maybe even less. It needs 40 v502 drops before a über might drop ratio wise. I find it reasonable...but I won't be mad if it won't happen.
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It's not "cool" for people who actually hunt ubers though.
 
After thinking about it, we're not going to do anything with the rates. It's very obvious you're not supposed to find those items, yes it's a wasted slot, no, nobody cares. (because honestly, if we're talking about wasted slots, there's a hell of a lot of junk rares out there)

It's also kind of out of the scope of these changes, as this wasn't the plan in the first place. They may be tweaked slightly, but they are not going to be put into the realm of possibility.

While nothing you actually hunt should be higher than 1/28,000 (or whatever, a point I do agree with), you're not supposed to actually hunt these items on these IDs and I think their rates as they are actually make more sense as a miracle drop.

So in short: Off the subject. We'll figure out what to do with this, if anything happens, let's focus on other things.

Random thing: Removed PoM from Bluefull Belra because it was too easy with VR1.
 
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Matt said:
If you notice anything that is clearly a mistake (e.g. a hunt people are currently interested in has been removed), please let us know as well.
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I still think Dolmolm Whitill Flight Fan should be deleted and Spirit Garment should be put back. (Isn't Flight Fan a junk item and not useful at all? Or am I mistaken?). Flight Fan drops from Whitill in episode 1, so it's not actually being removed from the chart (or the ID)
 
It's easier to hunt on Very Hard, so I doubt it would make much of a difference.

I could probably put it back though... pretty sure it got moved but if it's in Episode 1 it doesn't really matter.
 
I think we should take a look at the origin of why we are proposing these drop chart changes. The purpose of this is to get us playing in areas that for the most part dont get much play at all from the majority of the playerbase. I dont want to get into specific details of breaking down each drop from each ID. But for the most part imo spaceship is laking feasible drops to get us to play spaceship aside from the guren drop from 2 IDs and as far as jungle, mountain, and seaside i see no movement at all. I do see buffs to the Tower mobs though.... Im pretty sure that playing tower missions is actually a thing that a lot of the playerbase plays to begin with... Maybe deligate those drops elsewhere?
 
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