Red Ring RDR in Seasons feels imbalanced.

S

Sun

Member
The nerf to 1/186 looks like it was done with TTF in mind, except the problem is that TTF is gone in Seasons, making Red Ring excessively rare in Seasons. There's also the issue of Ep1 quests being rather underplayed compared to Ep2 and Ep4 outside of Red Weapon Hunts and Survey completions for Achievements.

TTF should stay gone in Seasons, but I feel a solution would be to either give RR it's own "Seasons" RDR, or if that's not possible, place a RDR plenty in TTF, but just rescale the Boss drops around it (or just on TTF Falz, in case this messes with Torr hunting). This way, player would be more included to hunt RR through non-TTF quests with Falzs, such as MA41C.

I know it's the best shield in the game, and thus should be rare, but the "imbalance" just irks me a bit.
 
I mean, only 2 players are even high enough level to equip it atm so it's not that big of an issue yet. I agree the rate is low and the trek to Falz is longer than normal but I guess I'm just not worried about getting a red ring until I have a character that can actually use one.

If i ever find one, great. If not, that's kinda what I expect anyway.
 
I think the rate is fine even in Seasons now that DAR reduction for full parties is gone. Well, for this Season, at least. Maybe for the next one something could be done.

How quickly can you get to Falz in Seasons?
 
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Red Ring isn't an achievement or anything and if you really want it you can hunt when seasons ends instead of time-wasting now. Yes ATA is OP but it's overrated, You don't NEED red ring, it just makes the day easier. I think the rate is fine as it is, for the best shield in the game.

You might see me complaining all day my HUcast is missing though :wacko:
 
This is one of those cases where Rangers really get a free pass with Ranger Wall.

It's really stupid that RA Wall gives more ATA than HU Wall gives ATP. They should just change HU Wall to give + 15 ATA and be done with it. If one ATA is worth 10 ATP, which is the general assumption, then RA Wall is over 10x better than HU Wall.
 
Visible ATA is divided by 10, so DEX really gives 5 ATA, and Marksman/Arm really gives 30 ATA. Ade is correct in a mathematical sense, although I don't think you can equate ATP and ATA in such a manner, as ATA has an obtainable point of perfection on many enemies, while ATP does not, i.e. once you reach 100% chance to hit, having extra ATA means nothing, but it's much harder to reach a point where you have enough ATP to 1HKO each enemy with a single special or heavy attack.

As such, the calculus of whether ATP or ATA is more valuable point-for-point depends upon how much you have of both stats and thus how close you are to reliable accuracy and how many hits you need to kill the enemy. Having tons of ATP is useless if you always miss, and having tons of ATA is useless if you do 0 damage.
 
Correct me if I'm wrong, but the point of Seasons is to make it feel like new again. Red ring wasn't even really available when this game first came out when many of us played it in the beginning. I think the RDR is fine.
 
Aleron Ives said:
Visible ATA is divided by 10, so DEX really gives 5 ATA, and Marksman/Arm really gives 30 ATA. Ade is correct in a mathematical sense, although I don't think you can equate ATP and ATA in such a manner, as ATA has an obtainable point of perfection on many enemies, while ATP does not, i.e. once you reach 100% chance to hit, having extra ATA means nothing, but it's much harder to reach a point where you have enough ATP to 1HKO each enemy with a single special or heavy attack.

As such, the calculus of whether ATP or ATA is more valuable point-for-point depends upon how much you have of both stats and thus how close you are to reliable accuracy and how many hits you need to kill the enemy. Having tons of ATP is useless if you always miss, and having tons of ATA is useless if you do 0 damage.
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Well, yes, but I think it's important not to regress into scrupulosity; my main argument is that one point of ATA is significantly more weighted than one point of ATP, so for a "class equivalent" shield to give Rangers MORE ATA than the HU version gives ATP is senseless, regardless of the strict numerical values.
 
I did manage to get S-Parts 2.01 from Coren, so the harder to find RR isn't too big of a deal to me; I just feel that Ep1 is underplayed in Seasons due to that + achievement set up (the Red Wep hunts are usually just one area -> remake).

Somewhat unrelated, but how come S-Parts 2.01 didn't get added to the Ultimate Drop Table in the Drop Chart revamp?
 
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Sun said:
I did manage to get S-Parts 2.01 from Coren, so the harder to find RR isn't too big of a deal to me; I just feel that Ep1 is underplayed in Seasons due to that + achievement set up (the Red Wep hunts are usually just one area -> remake).

Somewhat unrelated, but how come S-Parts 2.01 didn't get added to the Ultimate Drop Table in the Drop Chart revamp?
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Beats me. Maybe its the low level requirement to equip it, as well as the lower defensive stats compared to most of the other rare barriers. 25-32 DFP/65-72 EVP IS kinda low compared to the Hunter/Ranger wall, for instance. Not a huge deal if you can avoid taking damage, though.
 
Ade said:
my main argument is that one point of ATA is significantly more weighted than one point of ATP, so for a "class equivalent" shield to give Rangers MORE ATA than the HU version gives ATP is senseless, regardless of the strict numerical values.
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Yes, but you have to remember that walls, as well as S-Parts, are V1 items, and V1 is the one version where ATA is completely meaningless, so these items were never meant to be godly and highly desirable for play in Ultimate, which didn't even exist at the time. Sega was just too lazy to rebalance the stat boosts (and actually actively broke them) for V3, so novelty items suddenly, and unintentionally, became ubers.

Of course, walls are unobtainable in GC, most likely to hide the fact that Force Wall doesn't give MST, so the brokenness of Ranger Wall didn't become a factor until BB. There are multiple ways to address the problem, but all of them require making subjective changes to the game.
 
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